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 Post subject: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 6:47 am 
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Monkey House Exhibit
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... and the way I read it, that price tag is just Cindercone, not the thousands of ships that are presumably stowed inside her.


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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 7:00 am 
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WE'RE RICH!

Just thought I'd luxuriate in that feeling for a moment.


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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 8:44 am 
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Arancaytar wrote:
... and the way I read it, that price tag is just Cindercone, not the thousands of ships that are presumably stowed inside her.

That makes sense ... ten thousand of assorted sizes was the sales pitch, and if many of them are the size of Neosynchronicity, they'll fit inside Cindercone.

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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 10:14 am 
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If so, then in the next strip (Rule of Three!) we may get a final narrator's note on their aggregate value, along the lines of "really, you should just stop trying to count at this point."


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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 12:32 pm 
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StClair wrote:
If so, then in the next strip (Rule of Three!) we may get a final narrator's note on their aggregate value, along the lines of "really, you should just stop trying to count at this point."

Or something about not bothering to count the digits in the absurdly large number.


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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 1:10 pm 
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Right, but how big are either ships? "500m" is a length. "8km" is another length. These are three dimensional objects we're talking about here. Call me finicky but volumes are far more informative parameters.

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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 2:13 pm 
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If Cindercone isn't spherical, she's darn close judging from today's rendering. So about 200 km^3.

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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 2:25 pm 
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Jindra34 wrote:
StClair wrote:
If so, then in the next strip (Rule of Three!) we may get a final narrator's note on their aggregate value, along the lines of "really, you should just stop trying to count at this point."

Or something about not bothering to count the digits in the absurdly large number.


Fortunately, we (or the F'sherl-Ganni, at least) do have a word for that.


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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 2:58 pm 
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Arctic Exhibit
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The absurdly large value is distracting from the fact that Kevyn is a captain again. (That may have been covered but I forgot)

I can't help but wonder if he's got an absurdly large fabber and science bay in Cindercone.

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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 3:33 pm 
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mesmorino wrote:
Right, but how big are either ships? "500m" is a length. "8km" is another length. These are three dimensional objects we're talking about here. Call me finicky but volumes are far more informative parameters.


The value you're looking for is the ship's displacement (e.g. Wikipedia lists the displacement first when describing the Nimitz class carrier, then length, then beam, then draft).

Cut Howard some slack, though, describing a vessel's size by giving only the length of the major axis is a time-honored Naval tradition. This works pretty well since most boats have about the same shape/aspect ratio. At some point to get more info you'd need blueprints, and length/displacement already gives you a decent feel for the ship's size.

In any case, you can make some assumptions (like that the length given is the major axis, that these ships are all roughly spherical, and loose spherical packing ratio of 65%) and figure out that you can fit 2500 Broken Wind class ships inside of Cindercone; a smaller vessel like Neosynchronicity could easily fit in with 2.5million of its similar-sized siblings. Once you start throwing around numbers like ~170*10^9 m^3 for Cindercone (or even ~65*10^3 m^3 for NSB03) then sense of scale kinda goes out the window unless you're accustomed to that sort of measurement already.


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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 3:53 pm 
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mesmorino wrote:
Right, but how big are either ships? "500m" is a length. "8km" is another length. These are three dimensional objects we're talking about here. Call me finicky but volumes are far more informative parameters.

Are you trying to convince us you can't compute the volume of an ellipsoidal explosion? Is this a set up for your needing to produce reasonable doubt?


As always, you have number if you need an alibi.


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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Tue Mar 31, 2015 5:11 pm 
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Hmmm... if I recall correctly the Tunguska was described as being triangular and eight kilometers long on a side and one kilometer thick.

Volume for the Tunguska therefore is 27,712,812,000 cubic meters

Giving Cinder looks to be pretty close to a sphere and with an 8km diameter her volume jumps up to 268,082,605,370 cubic meters.

Now some bits are being used for interior stuff like walls and such, but if the cargo space in Cinder was filled entirely with Ovalkwik, how long would it take Schlock to go through it?

Or perhaps more telling, what is his consumption point before he starts to doing something like this? ;)

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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 10:21 pm 
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Sendaz wrote:
Hmmm... if I recall correctly the Tunguska was described as being triangular and eight kilometers long on a side and one kilometer thick.

Volume for the Tunguska therefore is 27,712,812,000 cubic meters

Giving Cinder looks to be pretty close to a sphere and with an 8km diameter her volume jumps up to 268,082,605,370 cubic meters.

Now some bits are being used for interior stuff like walls and such, but if the cargo space in Cinder was filled entirely with Ovalkwik, how long would it take Schlock to go through it?

Or perhaps more telling, what is his consumption point before he starts to doing something like this? ;)


Or becomes large enough to be a LITERAL eater of worlds?

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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Thu Apr 02, 2015 10:33 pm 
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So these trans uranic elements are strong and useful, and so valuable they make gold look cheap.

They are also so dense that they make gold look light.

Would this chunk of stuff present a gravity effect on nearby asteroids, space stations and moons?

Does this delivery require an environmental impact report and permit ?


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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 12:27 am 
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Plane wrote:
So these trans uranic elements are strong and useful, and so valuable they make gold look cheap.

They are also so dense that they make gold look light.

Would this chunk of stuff present a gravity effect on nearby asteroids, space stations and moons?

Does this delivery require an environmental impact report and permit ?


It probably has a gravitic effect, but not a very far reaching one. The volume of the sphere of trans-uranic elements is about 268.1 km^3. Osmium (the densest element currently known) has a density of 22.59 g/cm3, so the entire sphere masses about 6.0564×10^15 kg. That's less than the mass of Ceres by about a factor of 156,363. (Ceres is 9.47×10^20 kg).

Hat-tip to Wolfram|Alpha for help with the calculations.

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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 12:44 pm 
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Arctic Exhibit
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This stuff is a good deal denser than osmium though, to th point where you can see its neutrino shadow.

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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 3:07 pm 
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palu wrote:
This stuff is a good deal denser than osmium though, to th point where you can see its neutrino shadow.

To be sure, but I don't have enough knowledge pf physics to even conjecture how dense that would need to be. :)

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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Fri Apr 03, 2015 5:01 pm 
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palu wrote:
This stuff is a good deal denser than osmium though, to the point where you can see its neutrino shadow.

If the stuff is matter made of nuclei with electron shells, and the PTU elements are from the hypothetical "island of stability", which seems likely, it's going to have real difficulty being more than ten times the density of osmium. Seeing neutrino shadows is about improved detection, as in detecting all of them, if you want, as described in the footnote here.

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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Sat Apr 04, 2015 11:45 pm 
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technojunkie wrote:
I can't help but wonder if he's got an absurdly large fabber and science bay in Cindercone.

The answer is no, probably not even a little one.

They are fresh out of fabbers to bootstrap an economy from right now, which is why they're buying the battleplate.


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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2015 8:20 am 
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So, what happened to Oisri?

Cindercone was eight kilometres in diameter, and contained enough PTUs to be beyond value, and change the course of history for the UNS.

Oisri's diameter was over THREE THOUSAND kilometres and, other than a single paanuri (which, with the right planning, can be easily taken down - for relative values of "easy") appeared to be relatively uncontested space for the UNS.

So what happened to the galactic-superpower level PTU deposit, and why do the UNS still even care about the bundle from the Oafans? Surely distance isn't a factor, and while we haven't SEEN worlds being moved by teraport before, I haven't heard of any upper limits that would prevent it.

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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2015 8:31 am 
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Quote:
One Paanuri
Unless it was never turned off and kept churning them out.

Or the Paanuri wrecked it.


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 Post subject: Re: 2015-03-31 Kilo-GNP
PostPosted: Tue Apr 07, 2015 10:39 am 
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Reaver225 wrote:
Quote:
One Paanuri
Unless it was never turned off and kept churning them out.

Or the Paanuri wrecked it.

http://www.schlockmercenary.com/2012-12-30

It looks pretty intact here and Petey refers to it as if it's still around. I'd guess that it's judged too large a danger now that the Gavs have turned it on. Or maybe Petey surreptitiously shuffled it off into some safe area while the UNS was doing rescue stuff and is going through the data himself. They might also not want to tear it apart until they've got all the data off it and/or figured out how it works to help better understand DMEs.


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