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 Post subject: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 11:02 pm 
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I have a thought for the current conundrum. They can't use the little booms because they are too little & the big boom is, in this rare instance, too big.

They cannot teraport about because of the TAD, but that goes into my thought. What if they launched a VDA node and had it limpet onto the tank, and teraport it away? We all know the tank wouldn't actually end up anywhere, and yet, it would still be gone.


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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2017 3:05 am 
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Malapterus wrote:
I have a thought for the current conundrum. They can't use the little booms because they are too little & the big boom is, in this rare instance, too big.

They cannot teraport about because of the TAD, but that goes into my thought. What if they launched a VDA node and had it limpet onto the tank, and teraport it away? We all know the tank wouldn't actually end up anywhere, and yet, it would still be gone.


Are military vehicles of that sort really helpless against something doing what the teraport does to them?


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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2017 3:06 am 
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I've wondered something else, actually. The suits contain inertics; ie micro annie plants that provide gravity control. Wouldn't you be able to use those as a makeshift TAD field to shut down a teraport?

Considering most military things would have inertics in them I'd be surprised if combat teraporting isn't easily resisted by any half-expensive military equipment.


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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2017 5:14 am 
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Reaver225 wrote:
I've wondered something else, actually. The suits contain inertics; ie micro annie plants that provide gravity control. Wouldn't you be able to use those as a makeshift TAD field to shut down a teraport?

Considering most military things would have inertics in them I'd be surprised if combat teraporting isn't easily resisted by any half-expensive military equipment.


You need to pulse gravity waves at a distance in order to disrupt Teraport, suit inertiics don't have enough power or the focusing aparatus pulse far enough away for it to be useful.

IE, you could maybe block a single Teraport - if it was *inside* the suit.


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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2017 6:00 pm 
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Suit inertics maybe, but tanks do have that kind of power. That's why tanks have shields. That is literally what shields are in this universe. So really I would think that anything with a shield has an implicit TAD capability within the radius of its shields. After all if you could normally teraport into a shielded vessel, then the long guns wouldn't be so devastating.

I suppose that means you could use teraports on enemy soldiers, but if you can get a teraport generator onto them its probably just as easy to get a bomb onto them and skip the intermediate step.


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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Wed Jul 19, 2017 10:48 pm 
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Honestly, it's probably much, much better to simply install a TAD system - which as we've seen can be small enough to be *handheld* - than to make your vehicles inertiics do double duty.

EDIT: and note that that single handheld TAD kept Cinercone and Broken Wind from Teraporting.


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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 1:10 am 
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From what I understand, though, the TAD doesn't STOP you from teraporting - it just very strongly recommends that you don't. You can still fire up the teraport, but instead of ending up somewhere else you just turn into atomic glitter.


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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 4:59 am 
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Atomic glitter can also be described as lots and lots and lots of gas. Both Kevyn and the narrator have described the result as "explosive". How big a boom would it make? Not enough to devastate half a planet, but maybe enough to kill everyone in the room?

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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 9:43 am 
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Rombobjörn wrote:
Atomic glitter can also be described as lots and lots and lots of gas. Both Kevyn and the narrator have described the result as "explosive". How big a boom would it make? Not enough to devastate half a planet, but maybe enough to kill everyone in the room?


That's not how it works.

Quote:
If they hadn't let us go, our explosive deaths wouldn't have had more than a fart's effect on the planet's surface.

Literally, the effect would be too small to do anything.

The first quote was referring to an annie plant pile going, not a teraport mishap.

If you're going for "not shattering the bits of the enemy right through your commanding officer" it's probably a good option, though. Assuming the enemy has no TAD, which is probably the case.

Teraporting takes a few seconds, too - enough to go "aaaaaaaaa", and probably enough time to shoot a teraport drone off while it's teraporting in to hit you.


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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 10:14 am 
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Reaver225 wrote:
Rombobjörn wrote:
Atomic glitter can also be described as lots and lots and lots of gas. Both Kevyn and the narrator have described the result as "explosive". How big a boom would it make? Not enough to devastate half a planet, but maybe enough to kill everyone in the room?


That's not how it works.

Quote:
If they hadn't let us go, our explosive deaths wouldn't have had more than a fart's effect on the planet's surface.

Literally, the effect would be too small to do anything.

The first quote was referring to an annie plant pile going, not a teraport mishap.

If you're going for "not shattering the bits of the enemy right through your commanding officer" it's probably a good option, though. Assuming the enemy has no TAD, which is probably the case.

Teraporting takes a few seconds, too - enough to go "aaaaaaaaa", and probably enough time to shoot a teraport drone off while it's teraporting in to hit you.

Fart on the outbound side, nuke on the inbound side

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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 2:08 pm 
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Reaver225 wrote:
Literally, the effect would be too small to do anything.

The effect would have been too small to do anything way down there on the surface of the planet, which was several hundred kilometers away and protected by a hundred or so kilometers of atmosphere. That's not quite the same as too small to do anything to people in the same room who are some thirty meters away and protected by some shipping crates and varying amounts of body armor.

A certain bomb known as "Little Boy" exploded 600 meters above the surface and flattened a city. If it had exploded 600 kilometers above the surface, then I'd say "a fart" is an appropriate description of how much effect it would have had.

A firecracker is too small to do anything to you if you're standing ten meters away. If you're holding it in your hand, then it's big enough to take your fingers off.

Distance matters. A lot.

Reaver225 wrote:
The first quote was referring to an annie plant pile going, not a teraport mishap.

It was an illustration of what happens when solid suddenly turns into gas.

Reaver225 wrote:
If you're going for "not shattering the bits of the enemy right through your commanding officer" it's probably a good option, though. Assuming the enemy has no TAD, which is probably the case.

I don't even know what you meant with that.

grahamf wrote:
Fart on the outbound side, nuke on the inbound side

[citation needed]

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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 2:29 pm 
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Rombobjörn wrote:
grahamf wrote:
Fart on the outbound side, nuke on the inbound side

[citation needed]

http://www.schlockmercenary.com/2006-06-08
http://www.schlockmercenary.com/2006-06-09

All the energy has to go somewhere. It just gets sent to the destination. Unless you subscribe to the idea of an entire ship being disconstructed to subatomic energy would be less energetic than a distant solar flare.

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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 4:26 pm 
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grahamf wrote:
Rombobjörn wrote:
grahamf wrote:
Fart on the outbound side, nuke on the inbound side

[citation needed]

http://www.schlockmercenary.com/2006-06-08
http://www.schlockmercenary.com/2006-06-09

All the energy has to go somewhere. It just gets sent to the destination. Unless you subscribe to the idea of an entire ship being disconstructed to subatomic energy would be less energetic than a distant solar flare.

How did you get that from those strips? All I'm seeing is that they wouldn't go anywhere, just simply explode.


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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 5:34 pm 
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grahamf wrote:
Rombobjörn wrote:
grahamf wrote:
Fart on the outbound side, nuke on the inbound side

[citation needed]

http://www.schlockmercenary.com/2006-06-08
http://www.schlockmercenary.com/2006-06-09

Neither of those say that anything at all happens on the inbound side.

grahamf wrote:
All the energy has to go somewhere. It just gets sent to the destination. Unless you subscribe to the idea of an entire ship being disconstructed to subatomic energy would be less energetic than a distant solar flare.

"With nowhere to shove these gravitational packets", how can anything get sent to the destination?

If most of the energy ends up as atoms and a minor portion ends up as heat, then the result will be an expanding cloud of hot gas, also known as an explosion. How energetic the explosion will be depends on the ratio of heat to atoms.

Furthermore, if your hypothesis were correct, then teraport interdiction would be mostly useless as protection, because anyone could blow up their enemy by teraporting a pebble into their base, home, ship or whatever. Nobody would be freaking out over long-guns because they would be busy freaking out over teraport interdiction.

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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2017 10:50 pm 
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The quote is "...a fart's effect on the surface."


When is the last time a fart was consider anywhere near a nuke in energetic capacity? So failure to teraport the tank would be a fart in the loading bay.


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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Fri Jul 21, 2017 12:00 am 
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evileeyore wrote:
The quote is "...a fart's effect on the surface."


When is the last time a fart was consider anywhere near a nuke in energetic capacity? So failure to teraport the tank would be a fart in the loading bay.


Again, not necessarily, for the reasons Rombobjörn lists. An atmosphere is a pretty good shield for explosions happening outside of that atmosphere, and the distance really helps.

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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Fri Jul 21, 2017 1:03 am 
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See, I understood the process of a teraport as follows

1) Tiny amount of subject converted to energy to power teraport

2) Subject turned into glitter

3) A billion tiny wormholes open

4) Glitter goes through wormholes

5) Glitter reassembled into subject

In an area of teraport denial, steps 1 & 2 can happen but step 3 and on do not. I believe we have seen this referenced in the comics as a 'terasplat'. An attempted teraport in an area of denial just leaves the subject as molecular mush.


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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Fri Jul 21, 2017 7:27 pm 
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Malapterus wrote:
See, I understood the process of a teraport as follows

1) Tiny amount of subject converted to energy to power teraport

2) Subject turned into glitter

3) A billion tiny wormholes open

4) Glitter goes through wormholes

5) Glitter reassembled into subject

In an area of teraport denial, steps 1 & 2 can happen but step 3 and on do not. I believe we have seen this referenced in the comics as a 'terasplat'. An attempted teraport in an area of denial just leaves the subject as molecular mush.


Step 1 is somewhat bypassed, because it was stupid to begin with. A Teraport is powered by an onboard Annie plant in some fashion.

Because seriously, while organics can technically handle having some random atoms or molecules removed, starship hulls cannot. It would introduce millions of points of metal fatigue with every Teraport, and wreak absolute havoc on any quantum computing components.

A lot of book one has to be edited for retconnage because it really wasn't very good. Schlock acting like a hormonal teenager, Tagon being blatantly sexist, a *lot* of characters speaking directly to the audience or with the narrator, Shep and Nick were even introduced via them talking about their expendability to the story!

Book 2 onward, Howard's definitely shifted it more to 'Sci-fi space epic' from 'stupid comic strip' which is what it began life as.

Book One and everything in it is basically a single case of Early Installment Weirdness peppered with Non-Indicative First Episode. (look up those terms if you're unfamiliar, though warning for live destroying obsession)


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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Fri Jul 21, 2017 8:25 pm 
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Kendrakirai wrote:
Book One and everything in it is basically a single case of Early Installment Weirdness peppered with Non-Indicative First Episode. (look up those terms if you're unfamiliar, though warning for live destroying obsession)

Early Installment Weirdness
Non-Indicative First Episode

Because I'm a villain helper.


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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Fri Jul 21, 2017 10:17 pm 
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evileeyore wrote:
Kendrakirai wrote:
Book One and everything in it is basically a single case of Early Installment Weirdness peppered with Non-Indicative First Episode. (look up those terms if you're unfamiliar, though warning for live destroying obsession)

Early Installment Weirdness
Non-Indicative First Episode

Because I'm a villain helper.

Because you are Exactly What It Says on the Tin.

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 Post subject: Re: Tear-apart
PostPosted: Mon Jul 24, 2017 7:48 am 
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Malapterus wrote:
I believe we have seen this referenced in the comics as a 'terasplat'.

That's right, that should provide some hints. Here's the terasplat. I notice four things:

  1. Bark went flying. That tells me that there was an explosion.
  2. There were chunks of bark still in existence. Probably other tree parts too. It looks like there are large numbers of flying needles in the last panel. That tells me that the tree didn't get entirely converted into other forms of energy, nor did it get heated enough to entirely vaporize it.
  3. Neither Hob (armored) nor Frapp (unarmored but durable) got seriously hurt. That tells me that the explosion was fairly small.
  4. In the following strips there was no mention of a mushroom cloud in amorph territory where they tried to port the tree to. That suggests that there was no nuke-like effect at the destination.

Now, the tank is bigger than the terapot was, and might make a somewhat bigger terasplat, but it seems likely that thirty meters' distance and shipping crates plus body armor would be adequate protection.

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