The Nightstar Zoo

Nightstar IRC Network - irc.nightstar.net
It is currently Tue Nov 13, 2018 11:54 pm

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 17 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2018 12:54 am 
Offline
Carnie
Carnie
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2012 5:44 pm
Posts: 2603
So, looks like Thurl decided not quite when promoted above Chief Warrant Officer.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2018 1:06 am 
Offline
Concession Worker
Concession Worker
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 29, 2015 9:52 pm
Posts: 1310
evileeyore wrote:
So, looks like Thurl decided not quite when promoted above Chief Warrant Officer.

I swear that somewhere in the archives there's an "over my dead body" about this.


That, and rejuvies gave him some stamina back.

_________________
Rule of thumb is that if you need to use a squeegee, they're at least Laz-4.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2018 2:04 am 
Offline
Reptile House Exhibit
Reptile House Exhibit

Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2012 9:28 pm
Posts: 276
That'd be the strip evileeyore linked. Anyway, Thurl hasn't been promoted. Check his shoulders, they still have the chief warrant officer's triangles on them.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2018 2:05 am 
Offline
Carnie
Carnie
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2012 5:44 pm
Posts: 2603
grahamf wrote:
I swear that somewhere in the archives there's an "over my dead body" about this.

Really?

/looks back up at the previous post with it's url link... ;)


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2018 6:24 am 
Offline
Reptile House Exhibit
Reptile House Exhibit

Joined: Wed Apr 18, 2012 9:28 pm
Posts: 276
Also, executive officer is a position title, not a rank.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2018 6:25 am 
Online
Safari Exhibit
Safari Exhibit

Joined: Tue Aug 18, 2015 3:32 pm
Posts: 186
evileeyore wrote:
So, looks like Thurl decided not quite when promoted above Chief Warrant Officer.


Chief Warrant Officer is a rank; Executive Officer is a position.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2018 7:48 pm 
Offline
Carnie
Carnie
User avatar

Joined: Fri Jun 22, 2012 5:44 pm
Posts: 2603
Barmaglot wrote:
Chief Warrant Officer is a rank; Executive Officer is a position.

So it is.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2018 9:57 pm 
Offline
Entertainment
Entertainment
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2012 12:02 am
Posts: 781
Barmaglot wrote:
evileeyore wrote:
So, looks like Thurl decided not quite when promoted above Chief Warrant Officer.


Chief Warrant Officer is a rank; Executive Officer is a position.

That is true, but doesn't being an Executive Officer require an officer's commission? The reason Thurl didn't want to go above Chief Warrant Officer is because that's the highest rank one can have without an commission.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2018 10:09 pm 
Online
Safari Exhibit
Safari Exhibit

Joined: Tue Aug 18, 2015 3:32 pm
Posts: 186
Exactly what regulatory authority is going to tell the Tagons who they can or cannot appoint to what position in their private mercenary company?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Mon Sep 24, 2018 10:58 pm 
Offline
Concession Worker
Concession Worker
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 29, 2015 9:52 pm
Posts: 1310
Barmaglot wrote:
Exactly what regulatory authority is going to tell the Tagons who they can or cannot appoint to what position in their private mercenary company?

Karl Sr?

_________________
Rule of thumb is that if you need to use a squeegee, they're at least Laz-4.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2018 12:14 am 
Offline
Entertainment
Entertainment

Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2015 10:40 pm
Posts: 704
Location: Land of the webbed feet
Motortiki wrote:
Barmaglot wrote:
evileeyore wrote:
So, looks like Thurl decided not quite when promoted above Chief Warrant Officer.


Chief Warrant Officer is a rank; Executive Officer is a position.
That is true, but doesn't being an Executive Officer require an officer's commission? . . .

No.

An NCO can be in command of something without being commissioned, and said NCO will need an executive officer . . . who would pretty well have to be an NCO or other (enlisted) rank.

Now anything that has an NCO in command is not going to be vary big or significant, but it's still a command.

For instance, a chief petty officer (E-7) might command a landing craft . . . his exec might be a petty officer first class (E-6) or Petty Officer Second Class (E-5). Theoretically, an exec could be any rank, but in practice the exec will be a bit lower, but not too much.

There is always someone in the position of executive officer, though the position may not be called that.

--FreeFlier


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2018 2:31 am 
Offline
Entertainment
Entertainment
User avatar

Joined: Wed Jun 06, 2012 12:02 am
Posts: 781
FreeFlier wrote:
Motortiki wrote:
That is true, but doesn't being an Executive Officer require an officer's commission? . . .

No.

An NCO can be in command of something without being commissioned, and said NCO will need an executive officer . . . who would pretty well have to be an NCO or other (enlisted) rank.

Now anything that has an NCO in command is not going to be vary big or significant, but it's still a command.

For instance, a chief petty officer (E-7) might command a landing craft . . . his exec might be a petty officer first class (E-6) or Petty Officer Second Class (E-5). Theoretically, an exec could be any rank, but in practice the exec will be a bit lower, but not too much.

There is always someone in the position of executive officer, though the position may not be called that.

--FreeFlier

Interesting, thank you.

So Thurl still might be a non-com.

But he is the XO of a ship captain, with at least lieutenants in that command. Since the XO's duties involve giving orders to those lieutenants, shouldn't Thurl be of appropriate rank?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2018 8:55 am 
Offline
Monkey House Exhibit
Monkey House Exhibit

Joined: Sat May 14, 2011 10:10 pm
Posts: 465
Motortiki wrote:
FreeFlier wrote:
Motortiki wrote:
That is true, but doesn't being an Executive Officer require an officer's commission? . . .

No.

An NCO can be in command of something without being commissioned, and said NCO will need an executive officer . . . who would pretty well have to be an NCO or other (enlisted) rank.

Now anything that has an NCO in command is not going to be vary big or significant, but it's still a command.

For instance, a chief petty officer (E-7) might command a landing craft . . . his exec might be a petty officer first class (E-6) or Petty Officer Second Class (E-5). Theoretically, an exec could be any rank, but in practice the exec will be a bit lower, but not too much.

There is always someone in the position of executive officer, though the position may not be called that.

--FreeFlier

Interesting, thank you.

So Thurl still might be a non-com.

But he is the XO of a ship captain, with at least lieutenants in that command. Since the XO's duties involve giving orders to those lieutenants, shouldn't Thurl be of appropriate rank?


Thurl probably has enough of his own "command presence" to make some admirals jump and ask "how high" on the way up. Some people you just listen to, and some people have to point out their authority, and the penalties of not listening to them, to get you to stop talking over them.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Tue Sep 25, 2018 9:29 pm 
Offline
Entertainment
Entertainment

Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2015 10:40 pm
Posts: 704
Location: Land of the webbed feet
There are a couple of things there . . . one being that smart junior officers listen very carefully to senior NCOs. They won't allow themselves to become mouthpieces for the NCO, but they will listen carefully.

Another issue is that Thurl could be acting Exec . . . he is the most senior NCO in the Toughs, and out of the people I see there in the nirvana sim, the only two officers are Para and Bunny, both of whom would be expected to be non-line officers, not permitted generalized command.

It could also be that Bunny is nominally in command, but deferring to her exec, Thurl, for administrative tasks, which is normal . . . the captain takes care of the ship interacting with the outside, and the exec runs the ship in the way the captain wants and so that the ship can perform the tasks the captain will need performed.

And that's without considering command presence . . . I read a paragraph from David Weber where the current protagonist came to the realization that a polite request from a senior NCO could also be a command from God. (She already knew this about captains and flag officers.) Senior Chief Wandermann had excellent command presence.

--FreeFlier


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 27, 2018 2:41 pm 
Offline
Monkey House Exhibit
Monkey House Exhibit

Joined: Tue Aug 26, 2014 1:53 pm
Posts: 429
Thurl threatened to "quit", not "quite".

He would have to be Non-Commander McBragg to be "quite" :-)

_________________
I hope Para never plays with Tenzy. The result would be terrifying.
Para and Petey need to have some dialog together. Just because.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2018 12:00 am 
Offline
Arctic Exhibit
Arctic Exhibit

Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 12:03 am
Posts: 98
Location: SoCal
As I (mis?) understand it:

Warrant officer <> NCO

Commissioned officers are "above" warrant officers, who are "above" enlisted ranks.
Sergeants, etc. are nco - non-commissioned officers - but still enlisted.
WOs are neither fish nor fowl.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 28, 2018 8:19 am 
Offline
Entertainment
Entertainment

Joined: Fri Jul 31, 2015 10:40 pm
Posts: 704
Location: Land of the webbed feet
jmaechtlen wrote:
As I (mis?) understand it:

Warrant officer <> NCO

Commissioned officers are "above" warrant officers, who are "above" enlisted ranks.
Sergeants, etc. are nco - non-commissioned officers - but still enlisted.
WOs are neither fish nor fowl.

That's pretty much it, except that NCOs are the senior enlisted: the spectrum runs from E-1 (recruit) private through E-9 sergeant-major/master chief petty officer.

In US practice, this is partially because officers hold a commission from Congress, and warrant officers hold a warrant issued by either the President or by the Secretary of their service. Warrant officers tend to be promoted from senior NCOs with advanced special skills.

--FreeFlier


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 17 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 6 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Barmaglot, Google [Bot] and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group