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Putting the Christ back in Christmas
http://zoo.nightstar.net/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=5122
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Author:  DarthBaboon [ Sat Dec 13, 2003 12:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Putting the Christ back in Christmas

"Jesus, the long haired savior
had a very shiny glow.
And if you ever saw it
you would call it a halo!"

And thats the only one I remember right now, but there are a bunch. Come up with your own!

Author:  Gerald [ Sat Dec 13, 2003 1:40 pm ]
Post subject: 

DarthBaboon: This isn't directed towards you, I just want to vent.

We had a long, long, long drawn out discussion on Christmas on the IW board starting here.

IMHO... yeah, we can have a discussion about the history of the holiday, and we can delve into how it's a pagan holiday that the Church decided to take in and alter for various reasons, and we can go into the entire "it's too commercial" thing and debate that and all...

But really, does any of it really matter? I mean, really, it's a holiday. There's no holiday contract that I'm aware of that says that if want to celebrate it, you have to celebrate it in a certain manner.

Be in some general goodwill towards man, cool. Be it some religious significance, cool. If you want to go and do the pagan thing, cool. Or if you just want to go shopping and blow some money, I'm down with that too.

Just don't get on a high horse and tell other people that they're doing it wrong. Nothing's worse than a condescending wanna-be intellectual.

Author:  gwalla [ Sat Dec 13, 2003 4:46 pm ]
Post subject: 

The true meaning of Christmas

Author:  Maveric [ Sat Dec 13, 2003 5:08 pm ]
Post subject: 

Gaming with Jesus. I love it :D

Author:  kreely [ Sat Dec 13, 2003 6:01 pm ]
Post subject: 

It's a day on the calendar. Deal with it =)

Author:  Jeremiah Smith [ Sat Dec 13, 2003 6:04 pm ]
Post subject: 

Some have hemmed and hawed
Saying Christmas is nothing without God
Don't get pissed
But Jesus didn't exist
And Judeochristianity's a fraud.

Author:  Pronto [ Sat Dec 13, 2003 7:02 pm ]
Post subject: 

jeremiahsmith wrote:
Some have hemmed and hawed
Saying Christmas is nothing without God
Don't get pissed
But Jesus didn't exist
And Judeochristianity's a fraud.


Allow me to introduce, jeremiahsmith, professional target. :rofl:

Author:  The General [ Sat Dec 13, 2003 8:00 pm ]
Post subject: 

Christmas is infact two separate holidays, which happen to both occur on the same day and have the same name for some unfathomable reason.

The first is a religious celebration, placed at the end of the year by some clergymen or other, to represent the birth of Jesus Christ. Why they thought this was necessary is beyond me. It's celebrated weakly by most Christian families, and wholly by mostly zealots and bible beaters.

The second, and more relevant, is a commercial celebration based somewhat off the old pagan Yule, the purpose of which is to make merry and be with one's family, and of course to buy lots of crap of various kinds. It has nothing to do with religion of any kind, and is celebrated throughout the world by Christians and non-Christians alike.

I happen to subscribe to the second, and couldn't give a crap about the first.

There. I've said it. And now I'm going to put this on a text file for future reference with anyone who wants to argue about the holiday with me.

Author:  Pronto [ Sat Dec 13, 2003 8:30 pm ]
Post subject: 

Yer wrong on at least one count.
Not all non-christians celebrate christmas. I don't.

I don't celebrate my birthday, why should I celebrate someones imaginary friends birthday?

Author:  The General [ Sat Dec 13, 2003 10:32 pm ]
Post subject: 

Pronto wrote:
Yer wrong on at least one count.
Not all non-christians celebrate christmas. I don't.

I don't celebrate my birthday, why should I celebrate someones imaginary friends birthday?


1. I never said they all did.

2. Jesus wasn't imaginary.

3. My point was that people don't celebrate his birthday, they celebrate the holiday itself.

Author:  Jeremiah Smith [ Sat Dec 13, 2003 10:58 pm ]
Post subject: 

Quote:
2. Jesus wasn't imaginary.


The Jesus presented in the Gospels more than likely is. If he existed at all -- which is a matter of debate -- he wasn't born a virgin, he didn't perform miracles, and probably did nothing more than preach and get dead -- in other words, any Jesus that existed isn't the one being celebrated.

Quote:
3. My point was that people don't celebrate his birthday, they celebrate the holiday itself.


It's quite possible to celebrate Christmas without giving a damn about God or Jesus at all. Many people just see it as a time for family, togetherness, presents, or -- if you're a cynic -- commercialism.

Author:  gwalla [ Sat Dec 13, 2003 11:24 pm ]
Post subject: 

jeremiahsmith wrote:
Quote:
2. Jesus wasn't imaginary.


The Jesus presented in the Gospels more than likely is. If he existed at all -- which is a matter of debate -- he wasn't born a virgin,


I'm pretty sure that Jesus, if he existed, was born a virgin. Unless he was the greatest mackdaddy pimp of all time.

Author:  DarthBaboon [ Sat Dec 13, 2003 11:49 pm ]
Post subject: 

Gerald wrote:
DarthBaboon: This isn't directed towards you, I just want to vent.

We had a long, long, long drawn out discussion on Christmas on the IW board starting here.

IMHO... yeah, we can have a discussion about the history of the holiday, and we can delve into how it's a pagan holiday that the Church decided to take in and alter for various reasons, and we can go into the entire "it's too commercial" thing and debate that and all...

But really, does any of it really matter? I mean, really, it's a holiday. There's no holiday contract that I'm aware of that says that if want to celebrate it, you have to celebrate it in a certain manner.

Be in some general goodwill towards man, cool. Be it some religious significance, cool. If you want to go and do the pagan thing, cool. Or if you just want to go shopping and blow some money, I'm down with that too.

Just don't get on a high horse and tell other people that they're doing it wrong. Nothing's worse than a condescending wanna-be intellectual.


Hey, I'm not trying to say anything. It is just a funny song I heard. It basically inserted Jesus into a whole bunch of Christmas songs. It was humorous. Funny, haha.

Anyway, umm, yah.

Author:  DarthBaboon [ Sat Dec 13, 2003 11:51 pm ]
Post subject: 

gwalla wrote:
jeremiahsmith wrote:
Quote:
2. Jesus wasn't imaginary.


The Jesus presented in the Gospels more than likely is. If he existed at all -- which is a matter of debate -- he wasn't born a virgin,


I'm pretty sure that Jesus, if he existed, was born a virgin. Unless he was the greatest mackdaddy pimp of all time.


Pimp Jesus and the twelve hoes... a story for the whole family.

Author:  The General [ Sun Dec 14, 2003 1:39 am ]
Post subject: 

jeremiahsmith wrote:
Quote:
2. Jesus wasn't imaginary.


The Jesus presented in the Gospels more than likely is. If he existed at all -- which is a matter of debate -- he wasn't born a virgin, he didn't perform miracles, and probably did nothing more than preach and get dead -- in other words, any Jesus that existed isn't the one being celebrated.


He was still there. Saint Nicholas existed too.

Author:  SirGecko [ Mon Dec 15, 2003 7:51 pm ]
Post subject: 

jeremiahsmith wrote:
Quote:
2. Jesus wasn't imaginary.


The Jesus presented in the Gospels more than likely is. If he existed at all -- which is a matter of debate -- he wasn't born a virgin, he didn't perform miracles, and probably did nothing more than preach and get dead -- in other words, any Jesus that existed isn't the one being celebrated.

Quote:
3. My point was that people don't celebrate his birthday, they celebrate the holiday itself.


It's quite possible to celebrate Christmas without giving a damn about God or Jesus at all. Many people just see it as a time for family, togetherness, presents, or -- if you're a cynic -- commercialism.


Well you must remember that although you yourself may not believe that Jesus ever existed, his existence is a foundation of belief for a very large portion of the world. Your viewpoints are your veiwpoints, but don't try to present them as facts. No ones trying to push Jesus on you, so you don't need to discredit anyone elses views.


Also this whole discussion really has nothing to do with what the thread started out as. It's funny, we laugh. Thats about it.

Author:  DarthBaboon [ Mon Dec 15, 2003 8:21 pm ]
Post subject: 

jeremiahsmith wrote:
Quote:
2. Jesus wasn't imaginary.


The Jesus presented in the Gospels more than likely is. If he existed at all -- which is a matter of debate -- he wasn't born a virgin, he didn't perform miracles, and probably did nothing more than preach and get dead -- in other words, any Jesus that existed isn't the one being celebrated.


And how, exactly do you plan to prove that?

Author:  DarthBaboon [ Mon Dec 15, 2003 8:24 pm ]
Post subject: 

And by the way, I sugest that this topic move the Voice and the Snake if further theological discusion is to happen.

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