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The Nightstar Zoo • View topic - Creationists make me mad.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2005 3:14 pm 


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2005 4:18 pm 
Science cannot discuss the existence of the supernatural at all, by definition. The scientific method requires reproducibility to work; there must be several independent, sceptical observers all viewing the same phenomenon and trying to determine which model provides the best available explanation for it.

Miraculous or supernatural events are by their very nature subjective and non-reproducible, and as such they are a blind spot to science. Even the most careful observation of them is null data.

An honest scientist will acknowledge the limits of the scientific method, and indeed would see it as one of the definitive qualities separating science from religion: it does not claim to be a source of absolute truth.

Of course, there are many scientists whose religious faith is drawn from their scientific convictions (what is sometimes termed 'scientism', though this is also used to denote the use of the trappings of science to bolster a mystical or pseudoscientific claim), such as the True Believers who make up CSICOP. The fact that most of them don't realize that what they are talking about is religion rather than science can present its own problems, which seems to be the sort of thing which Kazriko is talking about.

As for myself, I don't see a conflict between my scientific opinions and my mysticism, even when they logically contradict each other, because they deal with different levels of reality. Even when 'supernatural' events appear to influence objective reality, they are not subject to scientific scrutiny for the reasons given above. The fact that my philosophy and praxis are intentionally absurd makes this easier than for most, I expect.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2005 4:50 pm 
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Vorpal Bunny Slipper
Vorpal Bunny Slipper

Joined: Sun May 12, 2002 2:54 am
Posts: 2707

_________________
Scharr, scharr, verscharr das Gebein, grab es tief unten im Keller ein.
Später dann graben es andere aus, und nennen dein Haus das Knochenhaus.
Scharr, scharr, verscharr das Gebein, leg auch ihre weißen Schädel hinein.
Mit Beton gießt du es aus, das Fundament vom Knochenhaus.
Scharr, scharr, verscharr das Gebein, da ist noch Platz, da paßt noch wer rein.
Hier tobte sich der Teufel aus, unten im Keller im Knochenhaus.


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 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 11, 2005 11:57 pm 


Last edited by Schol-R-LEA on Sat Feb 12, 2005 12:22 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2005 12:17 am 
Offline
Vorpal Bunny Slipper
Vorpal Bunny Slipper

Joined: Sun May 12, 2002 2:54 am
Posts: 2707

_________________
Scharr, scharr, verscharr das Gebein, grab es tief unten im Keller ein.
Später dann graben es andere aus, und nennen dein Haus das Knochenhaus.
Scharr, scharr, verscharr das Gebein, leg auch ihre weißen Schädel hinein.
Mit Beton gießt du es aus, das Fundament vom Knochenhaus.
Scharr, scharr, verscharr das Gebein, da ist noch Platz, da paßt noch wer rein.
Hier tobte sich der Teufel aus, unten im Keller im Knochenhaus.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2005 12:23 am 


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2005 1:28 am 


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2005 2:02 am 
Offline
Vorpal Bunny Slipper
Vorpal Bunny Slipper

Joined: Sun May 12, 2002 2:54 am
Posts: 2707

_________________
Scharr, scharr, verscharr das Gebein, grab es tief unten im Keller ein.
Später dann graben es andere aus, und nennen dein Haus das Knochenhaus.
Scharr, scharr, verscharr das Gebein, leg auch ihre weißen Schädel hinein.
Mit Beton gießt du es aus, das Fundament vom Knochenhaus.
Scharr, scharr, verscharr das Gebein, da ist noch Platz, da paßt noch wer rein.
Hier tobte sich der Teufel aus, unten im Keller im Knochenhaus.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2005 2:04 am 


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2005 11:58 am 


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2005 12:00 pm 


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2005 12:49 pm 


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2005 12:56 pm 


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2005 1:08 pm 


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2005 1:18 pm 


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2005 1:22 pm 


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sat Feb 12, 2005 6:25 pm 


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Feb 13, 2005 1:13 am 


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Feb 13, 2005 2:29 am 


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Sun Feb 13, 2005 5:08 am 
Offline
Vorpal Bunny Slipper
Vorpal Bunny Slipper

Joined: Sun May 12, 2002 2:54 am
Posts: 2707

_________________
Scharr, scharr, verscharr das Gebein, grab es tief unten im Keller ein.
Später dann graben es andere aus, und nennen dein Haus das Knochenhaus.
Scharr, scharr, verscharr das Gebein, leg auch ihre weißen Schädel hinein.
Mit Beton gießt du es aus, das Fundament vom Knochenhaus.
Scharr, scharr, verscharr das Gebein, da ist noch Platz, da paßt noch wer rein.
Hier tobte sich der Teufel aus, unten im Keller im Knochenhaus.


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 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Just to say something.
PostPosted: Sun Feb 13, 2005 7:42 am 


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 13, 2005 1:48 pm 


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PostPosted: Sun Feb 13, 2005 3:21 pm 


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Feb 14, 2005 11:15 am 
Offline
Janitor
Janitor
User avatar

Joined: Thu Mar 25, 2004 11:15 pm
Posts: 2388
Location: In the middle of the Pacific Ocean, somewhere.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Feb 14, 2005 2:45 pm 


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Mon Feb 14, 2005 5:07 pm 


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Thu Feb 17, 2005 4:21 pm 
I would argue that the best solution would be to assert that ID is a valid philosophical position, but not a valid scientific position - it is an unfalsifiable assertion, and thus is outside of scientific analysis. The problem is that this society as a whole assumes that 'reality' is singular, and that there can be only one 'right' answer to any question. Also, most people have little or no understanding of scientific method (including many scientists); most people would assume that 'unfalsifiable' means 'true', when it really is closer to 'meaningless'.


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 Post subject:
PostPosted: Fri Feb 18, 2005 6:57 pm 


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